The songs featured during the recap: “One Two Three Young Woo” by Jo Byeong Hyeon and “H” by Roh Young Sim. The first is quirky, while the second is melancholy.
The political and ethical complexity of Hanbada’s involvement in drafting a policy that led to mass layoffs of married women.
The fierce and principled attorney Ryu Jae Sook, who champions women’s and labor rights, and who offers a thought-provoking contrast to Hanbada's corporate approach.
The idea of generation names in Korean clans, and how these were used to explore the relationship between Judge Ryu Myeong Ha and Attorney Ryu Jae Sook.
Attorney Jung’s jarring statement that attorneys are not meant to make the world a better place, but to defend their clients, no matter who they are.
Woo Young Woo’s internal conflict as she receives a job offer from Attorney Ryu and wrestles with what kind of attorney she wants to be.
The damaging but clever tactics of Kwon Min-woo, who secretly mails a legal memo to the opposing counsel in an attempt to frame Woo Young Woo.
The brutal emotional toll of litigation, as personal and irrelevant information (such as fertility treatment) is dragged into court to discredit the plaintiffs.
The bittersweet conclusion to the case: the women lose in court but win in the court of public opinion and in moral conviction.
The evolving relationship between Woo Young Woo and Lee Jun-ho as they try to navigate differing perceptions of what it means to be a couple.
The quiet decline of Attorney Jung, whose stress and physical deterioration hint at serious underlying health issues.
A linguistic and cultural deep dive into the Korean pronunciation of family names such as Choi, Park, and Yun, and the surprising differences when romanized.
References
Sharing a snippet, "Your husband's job is more important" the manager says... π² this made me so mad!
ReplyDeletehttps://www.netflix.com/watch/81566018?s=a&trkid=278685009&t=1230&d=45&momentUuid=cac9de09-7edb-40cf-b652-0c58c284ab90&trg=cp
"When a man loses his job he becomes jobless. When a woman loses her job, she becomes a housewife." The attorney says in court. Very striking remark, showing a double standard.
https://www.netflix.com/watch/81566018?s=a&trkid=278685009&t=1230&d=45&momentUuid=cac9de09-7edb-40cf-b652-0c58c284ab90&trg=cp
Yes totally outrageous! Layoffs are never easy but at the company I work at (large multinational in the US) they do them based on team/project. That can also be unfair of course because high performers can be let go just because of the team they are on, but being a high performer is not a protected class!
DeleteOn a lighter note - Happy Chuseok!
Or mid-autumn festival / Tsukimi / Tet Trung Thu
Yes, Happy Chuseok everyone! Thanks, SDguy for reminding us! Chuseok this year is Monday, October 6, roughly equivalent to the American Thanksgiving. It's a huge family holiday in Korea.
DeleteThis is one of my favorite episodes of Extraordinary Attorney Woo. The theme of women supporting women really stands out. Even though the female employees technically lost in the end, it still felt like they came out stronger than the company’s HR. I laughed out loud in several scenes, especially the ones with Jun Ho and Young Woo; they reminded me why this series is so endearing.
DeleteI just finished Tempest and I binge-watched the whole thing! It’s exactly my kind of series. I love a good, thrilling political drama.
TK, SD Guy, Irma, Happy Chuseok!
DeleteI loved this episode because of the heartfelt discussion that Sung Hee and I had about the case. We hope times have changed but it's clear that there still many situations where women are discriminated against, even when it doesn't make economic sense!
Layoffs are never easy and you hope that the very best people keep their jobs, but it always depends on the situation, the company priorities, the economics, yada, yada. Such a tough situation!
Happy Chuseok! Great episode! Lee Bong-ryun is great! When there was talk of a season 2, I was expecting Atty. Woo to be joining her character's law practice.
ReplyDeleteCurrently watching Tempest (Great action), Jirisan on VIKI, Just finished Jeonyneong: The Star is Born (Outstanding performance! Interesting that Moon So Ri played the mother of Kim Tae Ri's character and the mother of IU's character in WLGYT and both IU and Kim Tae Ri were up for Best Actress in the recent Baeksang Awards.) Just started Genie, Make a wish. Interesting show and I like it so far (I think this may be a better story than Uncontrollably Fond!) Also listening to past podcasts of Mr. Sunshine. So good!
TL, thank you for your comments! I LOVE Tempest! It elicited a lot of great discussions with my husband son, so what a win!
DeleteAnd yes, so interesting that Moon So Ri played the mom in both of those shows. She is amazing. I haven't seen A Star Is Born, but I am a HUGE fan of Kim Tae Ri, so it's on my list.
I just started Genie, Make a Wish and I'm enjoying it. It's hilarious, it's outrageous, it's silly, and of course, I love the magic! So good!
Happy Chuseok!
ReplyDeleteSeems like Hanbada should have done a better job in advising the company about how to go to lay off people. From my point of view it did appear that the policy was gender neutral, in the sense that the policy did not specifically state which spouse should resign. However, the implementation, with the company pressuring the women to resign was clearly discriminatory. I think the real legal basis for a lawsuit here is that the policy was discriminatory against married couples. I would have collected all the married couples and filed a class action suit against the company.
I am often surprised that South Korea does not have more progressive and socialist public policies like the Nordic countries or other advanced European countries. Those seem to be peer countries in terms of per capita GDP, and those countries are also fairly homogenous like South Korea – factors that support those types of policies. One reason may be a historical aversion to anything deemed “socialist” because of recent history. For example, in South Korea mothers are entitled to 90 days of maternity leave with the first 60 days paid by the EMPLOYER and the remaining 30 days paid by the government. That alone is a disincentive for companies to hire women of childbearing age. You lose your employee for 90 days AND you have to pay for it. I know for a fact that the hiring partner at one of my previous firms was extremely unlikely to hire married women in their late 20s – 30s for this reason. In contrast, in Sweeden, parents are entitled to 480 days of paid parental leave paid for by the state. For a country that is concerned with a rapidly declining population, it has very poor laws to encourage women and families to have children.
I really like the protest headbands. I think I would protest more here if headbands were a regular part of protesting. It makes you look like the Karate Kid or at least a cool sushi chef!
As for the leaked memo, Attorney Ryu would not have been able to use that in Court – at least in the US. Ethically, if you come into possession of something that is clearly attorney client privileged, you are obligated to inform the other side and return it. You are not even supposed to review it, although I am sure plenty of questionably ethical attorney would so. On the other hand, the HR Manger’s notebook is something that the other side would be entitled to in discovery in the US. However, my understanding is that South Korea has less encompassing discovery rules (what documents you are entitled to get from the other side in litigation). Kwon Min-woo is playing a very dangerous game, because if Attorney Ryu returned the memo to Hanbada, I think it would have been clear that he sent it, which would almost certainly get him fired, expose him (and the firm) to a malpractice claim, and probably get him disbarred.
I loved the discussion on Korean names and the pronunciation. I don’t know if listeners could tell when I was a guest on the podcast, but I really struggled with the Korean names. For one, because I’d never said them out loud. Also, because Joanna and Sung-hee use the proper Korean pronunciation and not the Westernized pronunciation as they are written in English. I even wrote the names down on a piece of paper for reference, but of course those names did not match up with what Joanna and Sung-hee were saying! And finally, you do not actually here the characters names said all that often in the show, as they are often called by their title as opposed to their name. Super frustrating, but interesting.
DeleteI also had no idea that the first part of a Korean’s individual name was related to their clan. And here I thought I was an expert on Korea! LOL. So does that mean the first part of your name is pretty much determined before you are even born? And do Koreans automatically know that someone is from a particular clan based on the family name and the first part of their name? For example, with Choi Su-Yeon, would the Choi and the Su make it clear what clan she was from?! If so, what was with the Judge asking all those questions about what clan they are from? And Sung-hee, since you said you no longer use your maiden name, would Koreans be confused about what clan you are from? I have so much to learn……
Before I get to What’s Malcolm Watching, let me address What Joanna’s 15 year old son should be watching!
DeleteMy first pick would be My Name. If 15-year-old boy doesn’t enjoy Han So-hee going undercover with the mob and kicking ass I don’t know what to say.
A movie I would recommend is Confidential Assignment, which is essentially a buddy cop movie where a South Korean police officer is forced to work with a North Korean police officer. And as a bonus for Joanna, it stars Hyun-bin. Yoona also has a small role in this movie.
If you really what to traumatize him, maybe the movie The Treacherous (about King Yeonsangun, the treacherous King from Bon Appatitte) or maybe Obsessed with Song Seung-heon and Lim Ji-yeon. I’M KIDDING. Do NOT watch these movies with your children!!! But they are both excellent.
And now on to What’s Malcolm Watching
I am back on the west coast and living alone which has opened up so much more time to watch K Dramas! LOL
Tempest on Hulu/Disney – I finished this and enjoyed it but it was not my favorite, mostly because the plot was bananas. But the chemistry between the two leads was off the charts! I think for the last episode, the writers watched the last episode of When the Phone Rings and said, “Hold my beer!” IYKYK
A Hundred Memories on Viki – This is still great. A really great coming of age story with complex emotional relationships.
First Lady on Viki – This stars Eugene (from S.E.S., the girl group from the late 90’s) as the wife of the newly elected president and forces trying to take her and her family down. It has shades of When the Phone Rings. If you like a drama where you’re constantly trying to figure out what the hell is happening, you’d like this.
Ms. Incognito on Viki – This stars Jeon Yeo-bin (Our Movie, A Time Called You) as a bodyguard for a Chaebol chairman who gets involved in an inheritance struggle. Maybe not the best explanation, but it is another thriller where you are trying to figure out what is going on.
Confidence Queen on Amazon Prime – Starimng Park Min-young. Need I say more?
Gennie, Make a Wish on Netflix – This just came out on Friday and stars Bae Suzzy and Kim Woo-bin – who I have issues with because he played Han Ji-Min’s love interest in Our Blues and is Shin Min-a’s real-life boyfriend! Some guys literally have all the luck! This is, of course about a Gennie who appears to give Bae Suzzy three wishes, but it’s a lot different than I expected. For one, Bae Suzzy’s character is a psychopath and is a lot like Seo Yea-ji’s character in It’s OK to Not Be Okay or IU’s character in Hotel de Luna. It is also hilarious! Maybe the funniest K Drama I’ve watched. The chemistry between Bae Suzzy and Kim Woo-bin is amazing and they are probably the best-looking K Dram couple since, well, Han Ji-Min and Kim Woo-bin in Our Blues. π The only thing I don’t like about this drama is they released all 13 episodes at once! Very unfair for people like me who have no self-control!
That’s it for this week. I’m off to have some songpyeo, hangwa and baekju!
Another Ellen on here! I agree with Malcolm on the predjudice against married couples in the same company; I saw it with the French corporation I worked for over 20 years. But with layoffs and coming back as a contractor, the laid-off spouse can still have medical benefits via the directly-employed spouse. A laid-off direct employee loses their benefits if they are converted to contractor status, so there was some rationale. That employee may have needed medical for other family as well. Attaching medical insurance to employment warps the entire system, IMHO.
DeleteThat still does not excuse pressuring the female spouse to volunteer, though.
I was told once that I was retained because I was single with no dependents, and therefore cheaper! I soon left that company.
DeleteHi Malcolm, as far as the naming convention goes, I don't think everyone follows the generation name custom. My impression is that maybe families that are more conservative or have a strong sense of family tradition might follow it, but I hear that in this day and age, people are moving beyond these practices. Some people are also favoring names that have a more native Korean origin and not the two syllable form that derives from Chinese custom. For example, one of my cousins is named Barami, which means "wind" (as in the wind blows). Also, the generation name might be either the first or second part of the given name, not necessarily the first syllable.
DeleteMalcolm, thank you for your legal comments. Sung Hee and I do our research and we try to apply a reasonable person's perspective to the show, but we're not attorneys!
DeleteAs for government policies, wow, you are right! Having the employers pay for most of the maternity leave is a disincentive to hiring women. Sheesh! Here in the US, I know that New Jersey and California offer paid parental leave that is paid for through a payroll deduction for ALL employees. I know this because I have employees in those states AND they took parental leave.
Glad you liked the discussion about the pronunciation of Korean names. We'll do more of it.
As for what you're watching, I loved Tempest and I am loving Genie, Make a Wish! Genie is hilarious, I love the crazy characters, and I agree that the two leads are amazing together. Bae Suzy is awesome as a psychopath!
I'll share the many recommendations that I've received for the next show to watch with my son and husband.
First time to comment here. I just wanna add a recommendation that I thought Joanna's son might like. Designated Survivor 60 Days which is a Korean adaptation of the US series. It's quite good and it starred Ji Jin Hee of Move to Heaven. Also this is where I first saw and loved Son Suk Ku!
ReplyDeleteHello Ellen, thanks for joining the conversation!
DeleteIt's so funny that you mention Designated Survivor. I think it was actually the second Kdrama I ever watched after Kingdom. I really enjoyed it. I love Ji Jin Hee, and the rest of the supporting cast was wonderful!
It was interesting because it started off like the American show, but since Korean law says there needs to be an election in 60 days, it added a lot of tension to the story, in that they had to resolve all the issues in the 60 days the temporary president had. Thanks for reminding us of that show!
Yes! I watched the US version back then and was bummed it got canceled!
DeleteJust so happy to be a part of this community. Looking forward to the next meet and greet!
And, awesome episode π
Ellen, thanks for commenting! Welcome!
DeleteThank you for your recommendation for my son! I'll share all of the recommendations in the next episode. My family decided on Signal for our next show and so far, my son and husband love it. I'm keeping a list and have put Designated Survivor 60 Days on it!
I am so on board with Signal! (My #6) pls consider this in your future seasons!
DeleteI fully agree that this is one of the best episodes in the series.
ReplyDeleteBut, I am afraid I don't have anything of substance to add to what Joanna & Sunghee said in the podcast.
I also liked the episode because both Junho & SuYeon pushed back at WYW. Not that they had much luck lol.
I also loved the discussion on names, and wouldn't mind Part 2 with further exploration.
I finished "Jeongnyeon: The Star Is Born" (It has the same director of The Red Sleeve). Loved it. Probably my favourite watch of 2025. It was only 12 episodes. And, I have been fine so far with that length. But, I think this would have been better if it was 16.
Kim Tae-ri is just amazing! (btw.. Moon Soori is her mother. Apparently Kim Tae-ri asked her to take the role. I guess she got jealous of IU lool)
..and Joanna, for once I am going to mention a song. I LOVED this one. I am listening to it everyday many many times. I am leaving a link. DON'T google the song, because you mght get a clip which will be part spoiler.
It is sung by Kim Tae-ri.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbHtSepBkxM&list=RDMbHtSepBkxM&start_radio=1
I just realised that Tangerine was actually after Jeongnyeon..DOH!
DeleteSeven Seas! So glad you liked this episode of EAW! Sung Hee and I certainly enjoyed our discussion of it.
DeleteJeongnyeon: The Star is Born is on the list. I ADORE Kim Tae-ri! I loved her in 25 21. I even loved Alienoid! It's on the list, especially since she won the Baeksang this year for this role!
Thank you for the song recommendation. I listened. Very interesting! I would not have guessed that Kim Tae-ri sun this song. These multi-talented Korean actors! Thank you for the link.
Welcome other Ellen! I think I fixed it so that my last name now appears.
ReplyDelete